Riots...

[sbthang]

My thoughts go out to those innocently caught up in these appalling atrocities and those who are trying to pick up the pieces....

Absolutely - I'm with you 100% on this.

Fire is not necessarily best fought with fire though...

Hmmm - not sure about this one, though - there really doesn't seemed to have been an 'authoritative' stance taken by the authorities thus far; it hasn't quelled the riots...I think it fair to say that it's probably encouraged the little scroats to be more brazen..

I really don't want to start a flame-war on this guys, so now I've said my piece, I'll retire gracefully.

Steve

[Eddie]

I think the "policing by consent" days are over. We need a curfew they is imposed by the army if needs be. I'm not taking a permanent thing, but for a week perhaps till the momentum is lost.

[El Catador]

Thanks monkey!

So good it's worth repeating... Word...for....word!

I'm going to make some comments as I am so angry about this.... of course just MHO's.

This is base criminality, opportunism and nothing to do with the original issues in Tottenham.

This is one of the long-term consequence's of emancipating our teachers and Police combined with our bizarre 'entitlement' culture. Add to this a challenging economic climate and our failure to address the feral youth culture (that has been growing for the last 10 years) and this is the result.

Poverty is no excuse, plenty of us grew up 'without' and it doesn't justify mass criminal behaviour.

IMHO the govt/police should impose a curfew and come down HARD on anyone breaching the rules. It is about time we gave some power back to the Police and reminded these immature kids that we have authority in society for a reason. I will have no concern if the Policing is less than perfect as it is not possible to police perfectly in a riot situation. If you do not want a truncheon over your head/plastic bullet on your ass/tear gas up your nose do not put on a hood/mask and go out on the streets.

I heard on TV one girl when asked what she was doing jumping out of Curry's that had just been looted 'getting my taxes back' ....there is so much wrong with that statement I don't know where to start.

Politics doesn't come into it ....what has Curry's got to do with taxes.

I say come down hard and fast, put an end to this nonsense and then look at the social causes.

Parents of these minors - where are you??? How do you sleep knowing your children are part of this?

My thoughts are for all the innocent people who's lives have been ruined by these idiots.

My thoughts are also with the Police, fire-fighters and ambulance crews ....lets give them the support they need to deal with society's mess.

Two decades of 'sparing the rod'... and now the streets are awash with vermin.

I wonder how many of the politicians and community leaders who've spoken in the last 24hours know what an 'Oxymoron' is?
"I'm not condoning criminality... but.."

Jesus.
Time to draw a line in the sand and say 'This far and no further'.

[peanutpete]

I echo lots of the statments above, not much i can add.
on a personal level a good friend lived above the carpet shop in Tottenham high road that got burnt down and had to grab his wife and baby and make a dash for it,i have not been able to speck to him yet but to other friends and by all accounts has lost every thing but at least he is safe,my ware house is also in tottenham hale so a bit of worry there especially since i am still in france, maybe i should stay here. Any way please keep your heads down and stay safe.

[Puff Scotty]

Just heard on the TV,
a conservative(not that it matters which party) MP for Ealing say the goverment is waiting for the population to decide "what they would like the Police to do" !!!

How about "Uphold the law?" enough said!

When the "looters" are caught, charge them with Riot! not some piddling small charge which will see them laughing at the system yet again...

My feelings for whom this is happening on their doorstep, thank God I live in the countryside or I'd end up arrested!

[Lascaux]

Was at tottenham hale retail park 5 mins from my house on saturday, mental scenes of looting. They've boarded up all the shops there in case it all kicks off again tonight, which following the latest report on duggan might well happen...

[Eddie]

on a practical note: if the metal shutters didn't stop them, what use is a bit of ply wood?

[El Catador]

I don't wish to be critical of the Police...but... if they intend to employ the same strategy they used last night...

(i.e. Stand and watching while rioters: collect ammunition, loot shops, torch cars, buildings etc... and then... occasionally (and harmlessly), 'chase' them further down the streets to start the process again: i.e. collect 'more' ammunition, loot 'more' shops, set ?more? fires, etc).

...then it makes no difference how many Police they put on the streets tonight.
A toothless dog... after all, is no deterrent!

We're expecting to lose one of our offices shortly (it's two down from a Department store currently being 'visited') and sadly, there may well be others overnight.
Thankfully ALL the staff are safely out. But even so... to be told that there is 'nothing that can be done'... is a joke frankly.

Sorry, to disagree, but in the face of mindless violence? you have little option but to 'fight fire with fire'!

Have truncheon.. crack skull... simple really.

[sbthang]

Hear Hear Cat.

[Bigboned]

Believe me I understand the view of kicking off in retaliation but I don't think the train of thought of ' put the paras in front of them is the solution either! Put out a curfew then let the law scoop up those who don't abide.
Martial law is not the way, we tried that elsewhere not long ago......

[Deano]

monkey66 as usual has meant any view I have will only be an echo, his way with words is amazing.

Westfield is covered in police/security and barriers, thats the only affect its had on me thus far. Hoping it stays that way.

[Turbo]

Even out here I'm the arse end of nowhere we have some wannabe thugs!Gangs are converging trying to look bad-arse! Hoods up, limps on. Errrrr... Really? Let's hope all the little heros manage to keep it quiet tonight..... I'm on call for the hospital tonight! Gonna sneak in a PLPC quick before I have to go back to work.Glad everyone is safe!

[Detroit_Waves]

I echo lots of the statments above, not much i can add.
on a personal level a good friend lived above the carpet shop in Tottenham high road that got burnt down and had to grab his wife and baby and make a dash for it,i have not been able to speck to him yet but to other friends and by all accounts has lost every thing but at least he is safe,my ware house is also in tottenham hale so a bit of worry there especially since i am still in france, maybe i should stay here. Any way please keep your heads down and stay safe.

Oh jeez Pete, most importantly he is OK! For me, its almost so crazy its like its not real, and then you hear stories like this and it just breaks your heart.

Luckily faith is restored ever so slightly when you see so many people get together to try and make a difference, there were so many people out in Hackney today helping to clear up, I was just glad I could be there to try and help! Hopefully tonight all this nonsense will stop and we can all stop worrying and friends and family and get on with things!

[Simon Bolivar]

What many people don't realsie (including I suspect the rioters), is that the insurance won't pay out for riot damage, so those burned out of their homes will get no insurance to rebuild or buy an other home & in theory will be chased for their mortgage payements; in which case bankrupcy would seem the only outcome. I have never understood while roiting is exculded when there is so little damage done on an annual basis compared with flooding for instance. Any one in the Insurance game know if payments might be made? Norwich Union made their name by paying out for damamge during the war (war also being excluded) & many people stuck with them for a long time afterwards for that. Would be nice to see a modern company cover the innocent in this chaos.

[cj121]

It's all very naughty this malarky. Listening to radio 4 this morning, I heard an account from a resident in a London borough who had her flat ransacked by some egit. He broke in at four a.m and 'looted' her house, threatening her as he did it. WTF is that about?? Whilst everyone (with any noggins) acknowledges 'victimless crime' carries no credence, this took matters into the micro and personal. Sad days, and it continues...