Should I have said anything?

[Harleyfrank]

On the flight back from Cuba recently a guy was boasting how he bought a whole load of cigars cheap from... no prizes for guessing.... the brother of someone that works in the factory.... Heard that one before?

I was tempted to drop a hint that more likely than not, he's got fakes, but he was so boastful about it and how it's not a scam at all and it's all lies because he got it from a man who said so blah blah blah, and was so know it all (and just about anything you'd care to mention, not just getting cheap cigars in Cuba), that frankly, I thought, what the hell, if he's happy.......

Does that make me a bad person?

Frank

[AdamK]

Not really.

Bit late to do anything about it if he was on the plane anyway! Lol

[daniel2001]

Nope. Doesn't make you a bad person.

If he is happy with his purchase, and doesn't know the difference... Then not your problem.

Although part of me thinks you should have told him, simply because there might have been some pleasure to be gained from, erm, helping the chap realise he's been had ;-)

[DavidD]

I don't see a problem. He was clearly happy with what he bought and that's all that matters. We can't police fellow members of society on consumer issues. Every day, thousands of folk spend their hard-earned money on rubbish but, as it's their money, it's their choice and, quite frankly, their business - not ours. It's like the bargain hunters who buy counterfeit CDs and DVDs at car boot sales. There is also the likelyhood that your fellow passenger wouldn't know a fake Cuban from a genuine one so, at the end of the day, does it really matter ?

[tippexx]

at the end of the day, does it really matter ?

Only to TJ .... 'cos he's the one that has to get rid of 'em when they turn up here (as they invariably do) trying to flog 'em to us!

[Harleyfrank]

There would have been massive satisfaction telling him, but I figured he isn't the type likely to take kindly to having his statements contradicted and frankly, as has been said, his problem.

[DavidD]

Only to TJ .... 'cos he's the one that has to get rid of 'em when they turn up here (as they invariably do) trying to flog 'em to us!

But surely there is sufficient expertise on the Forum to safeguard ourselves from such exploitation. Also, I'm not sure that I agree with 'as they invariably do' as I suspect the majority are smoked in ignorance by the buyer and his pals or sold at a car boot sale ! I was gifted a box of fake RyJs a while ago and offer them to friends as such - most aren't regular cigar smokers and simply enjoy what they are given - fake or otherwise. There will always be a ready market for fake cigars. Isn't the important thing that we don't try to pass off fakes as genuine cigars ?

[DavidD]

There would have been massive satisfaction telling him, but I figured he isn't the type likely to take kindly to having his statements contradicted and frankly, as has been said, his problem.

Wouldn't the 'massive satisfaction' have amounted to 'I know better than you' ?

[Harleyfrank]

Aren't all contrary statements saying that in one way or another?

How to answer a question with another question....

[tippexx]

But surely there is sufficient expertise on the Forum to safeguard ourselves from such exploitation. Also, I'm not sure that I agree with 'as they invariably do' as I suspect the majority are smoked in ignorance by the buyer and his pals or sold at a car boot sale ! I was gifted a box of fake RyJs a while ago and offer them to friends as such - most aren't regular cigar smokers and simply enjoy what they are given - fake or otherwise. There will always be a ready market for fake cigars. Isn't the important thing that we don't try to pass off fakes as genuine cigars ?

As maybe. But I promise you, TJ's taken a lot of scalps! Taken one or two myself when the Mods haven't been around.

[DavidD]

I'm beginning to get the impression that there exists a general disapproval of fake cigars. Forgive me for playing devil's advocate, but I see that as a pointless exercise. In a world where there are fake Picassos, fake Rolex, fake Faberge, fake caviar and fake God knows what else, there is clearly a market for fakes in a million categories - if there wasn't, they wouldn't exist ! Isn't the important thing to define your own perameters and live within them. Putting my own reputation on the line - I neither like nor condone fakes - but that's me ! I am not my brother's keeper and, quite frankly, I don't want to be. Talk of 'scalps' is sabre rattling and unhelpful. There should be a universal acknowledgement that fakes exist - the important thing being that none of 'us' promote them !

[Harleyfrank]

Well said, but what's "scalp" mean?

[monkey66]

I do agree with you about 'scalps' Dave, schadenfreude is rarely an endearing character trait.

However you will soon see we get about 1 person a month who joins up to try to sell the fake cigars they bought from Cuba. This probably contributes to some of the disapproval towards fakes within the aficionado community. The other issue is a number of fakes make their way into legitimate channels which is a big deal for those of us who spend our hard-earned on overpriced bundles of leaves. These cigars pollute for years.

http://www.ukcigarforums.com/showthread.php?12923-Counterfeit-Montecristo-GR-s-and-Cohiba-1966-s

http://www.ukcigarforums.com/showthread.php?9075-Concluded-Fake-this-has-been-a-long-one-and-it-is-still-going

http://www.ukcigarforums.com/showthread.php?13117-Fake-Esplindidos-or-quot-You-like-Cigars-don-t-you-quot

There is an old saying ...you cannot con and honest man. This guy thought he was getting a deal, he did not buy through official channels so it was not a truly honest purchase, his choice. Don't get me wrong I am not judging but with each decision comes risk.

Personally I would not have said anything, cannot see anything to gain in that situation.

As you say the world is full of fakes of all kinds, this site is a cracker:

http://www.replica-jewelery.com/brand-category/replica-dunhill-lighter.html

http://www.replica-jewelery.com/brand-category/replica-stdupont-lighter.html

http://www.replica-jewelery.com/replica-category/replica-watches.html

[SmokeyDave]

"Take a scalp" is what the Indians used to do in the old days. (Scalp being the top of your head/hair)

David, you will find over time being here that a lot of people sign up with the innocent quote of wanting to get into cigars then almost straight away (well within 10 posts say) mention they had just got back from Cuba and have a box of Cohiba's they don't want. It is nearly always the large, big money cigars that are offered and they know full well they are fake. Just like the people who cruise motorway service station car parks trying to sell supposed genuine Breitling watched etc.

Those kind of posts/members go in cycles around the holiday season, once you have been here you can normally follow the cigars via auction sites etc, always quoting the story as above.

The reason they get frowned upon is even after they have been informed they are fake they move on to somewhere else to try and get top dollar for them and not say 'oh well, a lesson learned'.

[DavidD]

I believe that what has been said is all relevant - in its own way. However, on the basis that a fool and his money are easily parted, none of us can be the conscience of others. Individuals should, in my view, be responsible for making their own mistakes and, hopefully, learning from them. I have never supported the 'nanny state' and, as such, I am happy for folk to make their own mistakes. Who is most at fault : the guy who sells cigars at fake prices or the guy who buys cigars at fake prices ? I really do not believe that such issues should be the raison-detre of this Forum.